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The Project Payday and Net Income Solutions partnership - What it means for the average Freebie Trader

There have been more changes in the freebie industry over the last few weeks than I've seen since I began Freebie Trading. There has been a lot of talking, confusion, misunderstandings and frustrations. Many of you guys that read my blog aren't freebie traders, and if you are in this category, much of this won't apply to you, but you can still read :)

If you have done anything in the Freebie Industry, there is a big chance that you've heard of Project Payday. Project Payday is the site that got me going in the freebie industry. I'd never heard of Freebies before coming to their website.

This is the way the system has worked (at least since I started). Project payday gets A LOT of traffic. When people sign up at Project Payday, they get training information and are then directed to the Freebie forums where they can start trading. Up to this point, Project payday directed most of their traffic to The Free Lunch Room and a smaller amount to Anything4Free.

This has been the driving force of Freebie Trading via Freebie Forums. It was a great system. You register at the forums, get familiar with the system and referrals almost seem to find you (if you know what you are doing). The system was so ideal that it has caused many people to become lazy, sit back, relax and watch the money as it enters into their PayPal accounts. It has come to such an extreme that freebie site owners have let their entire business depend on these Freebie Forums.

On Wednesday, Project Payday made some changes that have caused ripples throughout the entire industry. Instead of directing their traffic (which is significant) to FLR and A4F, they started a new program called the Fast First Training. In this program, their new members are directed to making their first $50 with Kelly Martin. Evidently, she has managed PPD's customer support for over two years and is the expert trader that newbies will work with.

After trading with Kelly, newbies are then directed to a new forum called Net Income Solutions (NIS). NIS is a forum that was founded by Zollie Ferrell, one of PPDs first members. I remember watching a video of Zollie when I first started with PPD, where he was talking about his success as a Freebie Trader. I remember being impressed by him and his Mentoring website. Actually, it was when I saw his Mentoring website that I decided to build mine. I was impressed with the content of his site (but not his design) and thought I could do one like it (but with a better design).

Now here's the catch - You are ONLY allowed to use His Freebie Sites - Z Best Freebies. Also, in order to be a VIP member at the forum, you have to go green on all 10 of his sites. When I first read this I thought to myself: "These guys are CRAZY. They ONLY care about making money!" To put it mildly, I was quite upset. I thought to myself that they are basically looking out for themselves.

However, I continued to do my research to try to see if I could understand the logic (if any) behind this shift. Now although I do NOT agree with everything that they have done, I do understand the logic. PPD and NIS are responding to some serious issues that are prevalent in the Freebie Industry - issues that I have always been aware of.

Here are some of the issues:

1. The rapid proliferation of Freebie Sites. Since Freebie Sites came on the scene, many more have been popping up left and right. This might seem like a good thing at first, and to a certain extent, it can be. However, the problem that arise is that along with good sites, more and more crappy sites keep coming up, which can have a negative effect on the industry.

2. Outrageous promotions. All freebie traders like promotions. Many times, this can result in a significant amount of money above what is normally expected. In 2008, I received thousands of dollars in promotions, in addition to a Free Ipod Touch and 40 inch Flat Screen TV. I really enjoyed those prizes. However, what was beginning to happen was kind of ridiculous. Promotions started becoming the norm rather than the exception. In addition to that, sites were trying so hard to compete with promotions that other sites were having that it was starting to affect the sites negatively (in my opinion). When these promotions increase too much, one of the results of this is that credit values decrease and that is just not a good thing.

3. Free greens. This has also become an extreme. Instead of working to go green on sites (which is what drives the industry), greens are given away on such a regular basis, that it was becoming easy to get into the industry without doing the work that was necessary for the industry to continue thriving.

My interpretation is that PPD is trying to respond to this in the best way they know how, while flexing the Freebie Muscle and taking more control over the industry. To a certain extent, I understand where they are coming from and although I do not agree with everything they've done, I did know that SOMETHING had to be done to ensure the long-term survival of the industry. I can identify with some of what they are doing.

The main problem I have with what they are doing is the fact that they only allow Zollie's sites. That seems a bit extreme to me.

What this means for the average Freebie Trader

If you are an experienced trader who wants to continue with the PPD system and Net Income Solutions, you will have to use Z Best Freebies as your freebie sites. They also promote A4F, but quite frankly, I don't see how A4F is going to get a significant amount of New traders from PPD with the layout that PPD has. You have to do some searching in order to find info about A4F at PPD. In order to use Z Best Freebies, you will have to go green on their sites. For traders who have exhausted their offer choices, it would be hard to start over, but I have spoken to some who have done it successfully.

If you wish to trade at Freebie Forums with other Freebie Sites, you will have to stick to using FLR, A4F or one of the other Freebie Sites. PPD's changes has affected freebie forum traffic. However, the Freebie Forum owners are working on measure to get traffic from other sources. If this is successful, the other forums will continue to thrive and the industry will continue with several different options.

What this means for The Freebie Guy

I will not only continue with what I am doing, but will also continue expanding. I've learned that it is not good to rely on any one forum, site or individual to drive traffic to my sites. In my opnion, you should take your success into your own hands and not be passive in your approach to whatever business you are involved with (online or off-). Unless something changes, I most likely won't be using NIS or ZBF. Part of the reason is because I really don't like the design. I'm sorry, but I dabble in website design and that's a huge thing for me, lol. However, that is not the only reason. Because I've gone green on so many sites, it would be EXTREMELY difficult for me to green on his sites. Also, I work with GREAT sites right now and don't change sites easily, unless there is a GREAT reason for me to do so. I like to stick with what I know works.

My goal is not just to make money with freebies and help others do the same, it is to go beyond freebies and continue establishing additional income streams. My focus here is providing you with information that you can use to be successful in what you are doing. In the future you will see me including a number of resources that can help people succeed online.

My Recommendations to you

  1. Do not panic. Educate yourself on the changes and decide on what you think would be the next logical step. Read about what PPD and NIS have to offer and compare this to the other forums.
  2. Diversify, diversify, diversify. If you only have ONE income source and something happens to it, that will affect you negatively. Don't stick to one forum or one method of getting referrals. Also, don't stick to just freebies. Once you have a good handle on the freebie industry, start adding other online projects to your portfolio. It pays off if you do it well.

So what do you think about all the changes that are happening? I would LOVE to know :)

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Leslie Samuel is the guy behind Become A Blogger, the Learning With Leslie podcast, and the creator of Interactive Biology. Follow him on twitter @LeslieSamuel.
The following two tabs change content below.
Leslie Samuel is the guy behind Become A Blogger, the Learning With Leslie podcast, and the creator of Interactive Biology. Follow him on twitter @LeslieSamuel.

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  • http://makingmoneyquick.net/blog Onna

    Leslie-Thanks for addressing this. I noticed this the other day and was quite disturbed. I looked into NIS and I agree with you on all of your points. I understand why it was done and some of it makes sense to me. The two problems I have is that they only use the ZBF Freebie sites, and that you must green ALL 10 of them to use the site as a Paying for Referral Mentor.

    I have not used the ZBF Sites so I do not know how the crediting is or support. Those things are very important to me. I would be certainly willing to give it a try and attempt to green a few. But, to green 10 would be extremely difficult for me. I looked at the offers and my guess is maybe I could green 1-3 sites. 10 would be a stretch, as I have greened myself probably 30 sites. I do wish they would allow you somehow to green a smaller amount of sites for those who are experienced mentors and perhaps pay some type of additional fee to be able to post in the paying for referrals section of NIS. That way experienced traders will not be cut off from the PPD traffic. I understand the reasoning of not allowing the free greens, and I agree with it. But to require 10 sites alienates a lot of traders. Of course you would only be able to use the sites you greened on so you will be limited there. But, at least you could use the site and cashout on the sites you are able to green there using the Paying for Referrals area. I think it makes sense to green on a site before you use it, this way you KNOW how it Credits and the support is.

    Even if this were possible I still have certain sites that I like very much and would not be willing to stop using them. So I would of course still trade at A4free and FLR with those sites. But, as you said PPD drives ALOT of traffic to those sites. MY hope is that the forums (and Traders) come up with ways to drive more traffic to them on their own. I think competition is good so I am not big on the idea of just one site. That being said, I still would like to try NIS out along with the other Forums but I am not sure that will be possible for me.

    I agree that looking for other ways to get referrals and income is the way to go. That is why I originally got my mentoring site from you and started my blog. Affiliate marketing will be another source of income I hope in the future for me, but I am just beginning that journey.

    I had recently started to promote PPD but I am not sure I want to continue down that path considering that the other forums I trade on don't get much billing. This is something I will have to figure out.

    Sorry for my long rant! This has been on my mind. Thank you for bringing it up.

    Onnas last blog post..What is Twitter?

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      No problem with the long comment. These are huge changes, so I can understand everyone's response to it. I agree with you on the greening 10 sites. It's not a BAD idea, because it helps to make sure that VIP members are hard working traders, but to a certain extent it does alienate other experienced traders. I guess the issue there would be, if you start giving free greens to experienced traders, that would be a lot to monitor and you are (to a certain extent), compromising the standards you are trying to uphold. I'm not defending anything, but I do see the logic behind it. And YES, it's time for traders to take their success into their own hands. PPD traffic is great, but it's better to learn HOW to drive traffic yourself.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      No problem with the long comment. These are huge changes, so I can understand everyone's response to it. I agree with you on the greening 10 sites. It's not a BAD idea, because it helps to make sure that VIP members are hard working traders, but to a certain extent it does alienate other experienced traders. I guess the issue there would be, if you start giving free greens to experienced traders, that would be a lot to monitor and you are (to a certain extent), compromising the standards you are trying to uphold. I'm not defending anything, but I do see the logic behind it. And YES, it's time for traders to take their success into their own hands. PPD traffic is great, but it's better to learn HOW to drive traffic yourself.

      • Myrlenef123

        Leslie, I just joined PPD and very new to this. I haven't even started yet....still ready the instructions. My question is this, can a person realy make money doing this. It almost seems like a scam and i'm very causious of it all. They offer a quick $50 to get started and then all this money one can make by just doing these simple things online. Your always hearing, if it's too good to be true it probably is! Is there a catch to all of this.

        • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

          Hi there. I actually don't promote PPD and the freebie industry anymore. It is possible to make money with it, but it's really not a long term business strategy. If you would like to still do Freebies, the only forum I recommend is CaliStyle101.

          I can tell you this - you definitely won't make as much money as they say on PPD. I think they say $50 per hour, or at least that's what they used to say. It takes a lot of work, but you can make something.

          For me, the best model I've found is to start your own online business, based on your interest. It takes a lot of work to get going, but it can be much more viable than the alternative. Also, you can set up a lot of it on autopilot.

  • http://makingmoneyquick.net/blog Onna

    Leslie-Thanks for addressing this. I noticed this the other day and was quite disturbed. I looked into NIS and I agree with you on all of your points. I understand why it was done and some of it makes sense to me. The two problems I have is that they only use the ZBF Freebie sites, and that you must green ALL 10 of them to use the site as a Paying for Referral Mentor.

    I have not used the ZBF Sites so I do not know how the crediting is or support. Those things are very important to me. I would be certainly willing to give it a try and attempt to green a few. But, to green 10 would be extremely difficult for me. I looked at the offers and my guess is maybe I could green 1-3 sites. 10 would be a stretch, as I have greened myself probably 30 sites. I do wish they would allow you somehow to green a smaller amount of sites for those who are experienced mentors and perhaps pay some type of additional fee to be able to post in the paying for referrals section of NIS. That way experienced traders will not be cut off from the PPD traffic. I understand the reasoning of not allowing the free greens, and I agree with it. But to require 10 sites alienates a lot of traders. Of course you would only be able to use the sites you greened on so you will be limited there. But, at least you could use the site and cashout on the sites you are able to green there using the Paying for Referrals area. I think it makes sense to green on a site before you use it, this way you KNOW how it Credits and the support is.

    Even if this were possible I still have certain sites that I like very much and would not be willing to stop using them. So I would of course still trade at A4free and FLR with those sites. But, as you said PPD drives ALOT of traffic to those sites. MY hope is that the forums (and Traders) come up with ways to drive more traffic to them on their own. I think competition is good so I am not big on the idea of just one site. That being said, I still would like to try NIS out along with the other Forums but I am not sure that will be possible for me.

    I agree that looking for other ways to get referrals and income is the way to go. That is why I originally got my mentoring site from you and started my blog. Affiliate marketing will be another source of income I hope in the future for me, but I am just beginning that journey.

    I had recently started to promote PPD but I am not sure I want to continue down that path considering that the other forums I trade on don't get much billing. This is something I will have to figure out.

    Sorry for my long rant! This has been on my mind. Thank you for bringing it up.

    Onnas last blog post..What is Twitter?

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie

      No problem with the long comment. These are huge changes, so I can understand everyone's response to it. I agree with you on the greening 10 sites. It's not a BAD idea, because it helps to make sure that VIP members are hard working traders, but to a certain extent it does alienate other experienced traders. I guess the issue there would be, if you start giving free greens to experienced traders, that would be a lot to monitor and you are (to a certain extent), compromising the standards you are trying to uphold. I'm not defending anything, but I do see the logic behind it. And YES, it's time for traders to take their success into their own hands. PPD traffic is great, but it's better to learn HOW to drive traffic yourself.

  • Nicole S. Palmer

    Hmmmm....I commend PPD for responding to the notable changes taking place in the industry, especially with respect to FLR. However, I believe they should consider a happy medium. The exclusivity of their new venture will most certainly be a turnoff for seasoned veterans. Sure, newbies will probably be just as happy to work this way, but many of us have established partnerships and relationships with other sites--which have been around much longer than this new freebie network. My recommendation would be to offer additional incentives for making this new PPD network your primary, but exclusive? It will require some time of proving up their ability to contend with the networks already in place before I as a seasoned trader would ever consider dropping all my other current networks and signing an exclusive contract with PPD (something which should be reserved for employee-employer relationship; otherwise, why call it the "freebie" industry (which implies freedom and fun in my opinion). Just my $0.02 on the matter. Thanks for shedding light on this, Leslie!!!!

  • Aaron

    Leslie, so, i checked out NIS and I have to say I like the layout and process much better than the chaos that ensues on FLR. Don;t get me wrong I like FLR and will continue to use it to trade my other sites, but it is pretty hectic trying to get new refs to seek you out.

    One quick question. I have viewd the first ZBF page and there is not a link there to view the available offers. Can you speak on the amount of offers these sites provide? I am new to the industry, as you may or may not recall, but I have greened around 13 sites in the last 3 weeks and am afraid that the amount of offers I will realistically be able to do is going to be low.

    As I said before, I like the layout and presentation of NIS and I fully agree with you that you should have multiple streams of referral and income generation to truly suceed in this opportunity.

    If you have the answer to the number of offers i would appreicate it. if not, I will cehck it out when i get home to my personal PC.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      Hi Aaron, a good way to check offers if for some reason there isn't a link is to add this code to the end of the URL "viewoffers.php". When I did that the last time, I saw 153 offers, and from what I hear, Zollie has been adding more on regular basis. It's not as much as some, but it's definitely one of the more competitive sites in terms of offer selection.

      • Aaron

        Awesoem, thansk sooooo much. it also appears as if I am your first referral on NIS. Can't wait to start making some GREEN with ya.

      • Aaron

        Awesoem, thansk sooooo much. it also appears as if I am your first referral on NIS. Can't wait to start making some GREEN with ya.

  • Aaron

    Leslie, so, i checked out NIS and I have to say I like the layout and process much better than the chaos that ensues on FLR. Don;t get me wrong I like FLR and will continue to use it to trade my other sites, but it is pretty hectic trying to get new refs to seek you out.

    One quick question. I have viewd the first ZBF page and there is not a link there to view the available offers. Can you speak on the amount of offers these sites provide? I am new to the industry, as you may or may not recall, but I have greened around 13 sites in the last 3 weeks and am afraid that the amount of offers I will realistically be able to do is going to be low.

    As I said before, I like the layout and presentation of NIS and I fully agree with you that you should have multiple streams of referral and income generation to truly suceed in this opportunity.

    If you have the answer to the number of offers i would appreicate it. if not, I will cehck it out when i get home to my personal PC.

  • Nicole S. Palmer

    Hmmmm....I commend PPD for responding to the notable changes taking place in the industry, especially with respect to FLR. However, I believe they should consider a happy medium. The exclusivity of their new venture will most certainly be a turnoff for seasoned veterans. Sure, newbies will probably be just as happy to work this way, but many of us have established partnerships and relationships with other sites--which have been around much longer than this new freebie network. My recommendation would be to offer additional incentives for making this new PPD network your primary, but exclusive? It will require some time of proving up their ability to contend with the networks already in place before I as a seasoned trader would ever consider dropping all my other current networks and signing an exclusive contract with PPD (something which should be reserved for employee-employer relationship; otherwise, why call it the "freebie" industry (which implies freedom and fun in my opinion). Just my $0.02 on the matter. Thanks for shedding light on this, Leslie!!!!

  • Aaron

    Leslie, so, i checked out NIS and I have to say I like the layout and process much better than the chaos that ensues on FLR. Don;t get me wrong I like FLR and will continue to use it to trade my other sites, but it is pretty hectic trying to get new refs to seek you out.

    One quick question. I have viewd the first ZBF page and there is not a link there to view the available offers. Can you speak on the amount of offers these sites provide? I am new to the industry, as you may or may not recall, but I have greened around 13 sites in the last 3 weeks and am afraid that the amount of offers I will realistically be able to do is going to be low.

    As I said before, I like the layout and presentation of NIS and I fully agree with you that you should have multiple streams of referral and income generation to truly suceed in this opportunity.

    If you have the answer to the number of offers i would appreicate it. if not, I will cehck it out when i get home to my personal PC.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie

      Hi Aaron, a good way to check offers if for some reason there isn't a link is to add this code to the end of the URL "viewoffers.php". When I did that the last time, I saw 153 offers, and from what I hear, Zollie has been adding more on regular basis. It's not as much as some, but it's definitely one of the more competitive sites in terms of offer selection.

      • Aaron

        Awesoem, thansk sooooo much. it also appears as if I am your first referral on NIS. Can't wait to start making some GREEN with ya.

  • Stefanomen

    Hey Leslie,

    You got almost every points I wanted to write about. lol

    It is a very special time right now, since the industry is changing a lot... only because one site is modifying is preferences.

    Project payday is certainly a major site in the freebie trading business but there are other players that could consider changing their idea too. The affiliate companies...why aren't considering allowing anyone to complete their offers again... even if we completed it already... would it be to hard the start again from scratch considering the new reality? ;0) I'm only thinking out loud since I've exprerienced the same problem on NIS.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      It wouldn't be smart for the affiliate companies to pay you again to complete the same offers. The reason they are paying is to expose you to their offers. Once you're exposed, their job is done. If they did that, they would loose a considerable amount of money and that would be too much to sustain.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      It wouldn't be smart for the affiliate companies to pay you again to complete the same offers. The reason they are paying is to expose you to their offers. Once you're exposed, their job is done. If they did that, they would loose a considerable amount of money and that would be too much to sustain.

  • Stefanomen

    Hey Leslie,

    You got almost every points I wanted to write about. lol

    It is a very special time right now, since the industry is changing a lot... only because one site is modifying is preferences.

    Project payday is certainly a major site in the freebie trading business but there are other players that could consider changing their idea too. The affiliate companies...why aren't considering allowing anyone to complete their offers again... even if we completed it already... would it be to hard the start again from scratch considering the new reality? ;0) I'm only thinking out loud since I've exprerienced the same problem on NIS.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie

      It wouldn't be smart for the affiliate companies to pay you again to complete the same offers. The reason they are paying is to expose you to their offers. Once you're exposed, their job is done. If they did that, they would loose a considerable amount of money and that would be too much to sustain.

  • MacroBucks

    Hey Stefanomen. The advertisers wouldn't want a lead completed twice - all of them only pay for a new registration/trial sign up. Also, the recession affects that quite a bit more than usual. I wouldn't expect any rules on the advertisers ends to change as they are advertising to turn a profit and allowing multiple completions of the same offer would be counterproductive for them.

    Just wanted to let you know,
    Fehz

    • Stefanomen

      ;)

      Thanks for the reply. Actually I was aware of that but I tought that if if could be a profitable thing for the advertisers to do so it would be a great idea. On the other end it is a fact that most of the traders are only completing free or very inexpensive trials and most of them are cancelling it after it ends... I don't know if it could be a good idea to create a kind of "second level" of offers completion that would be profitable for the affiliates and that would allow the "old" traders to green on more sites.

      Stefanomens last blog post..Links for 2009-03-03 [Digg]

      • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

        Yeah, that's probably never going to happen. The Affiliate networks don't adjust their business to suit Freebie Traders. We are at their mercy. In fact, the reason we don't have MANY MORE offers to do is because MANY offers don't allowed incentivization. That's why you see so many similar offers between sites.

        • j777j

          Hi guys. I wonder how can I find a trusted IFW trader. Last I was trading with a mentor in NIS and after I when green they banned me out of the forum. It is a very long story and I do not want to waste our time... but please let me know how canI find trusted trader to trade with in method 1. I would like to have few IFW websites on hand before jumping to method 2. Thanks so much. GB!

        • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie Samuel

          @j777j Freebie Trading is dead. My recommendation - leave it alone and keep your money. This is a very old post.

      • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

        Yeah, that's probably never going to happen. The Affiliate networks don't adjust their business to suit Freebie Traders. We are at their mercy. In fact, the reason we don't have MANY MORE offers to do is because MANY offers don't allowed incentivization. That's why you see so many similar offers between sites.

  • MacroBucks

    Hey Stefanomen. The advertisers wouldn't want a lead completed twice - all of them only pay for a new registration/trial sign up. Also, the recession affects that quite a bit more than usual. I wouldn't expect any rules on the advertisers ends to change as they are advertising to turn a profit and allowing multiple completions of the same offer would be counterproductive for them.

    Just wanted to let you know,
    Fehz

  • MacroBucks

    Hey Stefanomen. The advertisers wouldn't want a lead completed twice - all of them only pay for a new registration/trial sign up. Also, the recession affects that quite a bit more than usual. I wouldn't expect any rules on the advertisers ends to change as they are advertising to turn a profit and allowing multiple completions of the same offer would be counterproductive for them.

    Just wanted to let you know,
    Fehz

    • Stefanomen

      ;)

      Thanks for the reply. Actually I was aware of that but I tought that if if could be a profitable thing for the advertisers to do so it would be a great idea. On the other end it is a fact that most of the traders are only completing free or very inexpensive trials and most of them are cancelling it after it ends... I don't know if it could be a good idea to create a kind of "second level" of offers completion that would be profitable for the affiliates and that would allow the "old" traders to green on more sites.

      Stefanomens last blog post..Links for 2009-03-03 [Digg]

      • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie

        Yeah, that's probably never going to happen. The Affiliate networks don't adjust their business to suit Freebie Traders. We are at their mercy. In fact, the reason we don't have MANY MORE offers to do is because MANY offers don't allowed incentivization. That's why you see so many similar offers between sites.

  • MacroBucks

    Just thought i'd add.

    The Freebie Forums existed WAY before PPD. A4F had the MOST members online in January 2006 (PPD wasn't around till early 2007). They had 2,500 members online AT ONCE!!!

    But once PPD came around, some forums got lazy and depended on them instead.

    What will we see now? We'll see forums and site owners including focused on bringing back that old solid traffic to the forums.

  • MacroBucks

    Just thought i'd add.

    The Freebie Forums existed WAY before PPD. A4F had the MOST members online in January 2006 (PPD wasn't around till early 2007). They had 2,500 members online AT ONCE!!!

    But once PPD came around, some forums got lazy and depended on them instead.

    What will we see now? We'll see forums and site owners including focused on bringing back that old solid traffic to the forums.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      Very good point. PPD did make it easier for the forums and for the Freebie Sites. There are many ways to get traffic and this is where creativity will come into play. The more I think about it, the more I think that this might be a good thing for the industry, forums, freebie sites and users over the long term. I look forward to the future :)

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      Very good point. PPD did make it easier for the forums and for the Freebie Sites. There are many ways to get traffic and this is where creativity will come into play. The more I think about it, the more I think that this might be a good thing for the industry, forums, freebie sites and users over the long term. I look forward to the future :)

  • MacroBucks

    Just thought i'd add.

    The Freebie Forums existed WAY before PPD. A4F had the MOST members online in January 2006 (PPD wasn't around till early 2007). They had 2,500 members online AT ONCE!!!

    But once PPD came around, some forums got lazy and depended on them instead.

    What will we see now? We'll see forums and site owners including focused on bringing back that old solid traffic to the forums.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie

      Very good point. PPD did make it easier for the forums and for the Freebie Sites. There are many ways to get traffic and this is where creativity will come into play. The more I think about it, the more I think that this might be a good thing for the industry, forums, freebie sites and users over the long term. I look forward to the future :)

  • Don

    Leslie – Thanks for the great information regarding all the changes going on at PPD lately – as always, your information is both timely and extremely helpful. I recently asked Zollie (Ferrell) about the details of NIS and PPD as it relates to the freebie industry, I thought it would be useful for the community here if I posted a summary of our conversation (via PM) so here it is:

    I had asked if there is a place for me at NIS, since I have greened about 40 sites personally, how would there be a place for me if I was now expected to green another 10 Z Best Freebies sites (without even being allowed to see the offers first)? While I was aware that Free Greens in the industry have become excessive, leading to significant oversupply of unqualified Method 2 traders, paid greens would go a long way to correcting the situation going forward – and I would think would be at least as effective as the “green 10 sites before you can pay for referrals” rule. Zollie essentially said that NIS was created to address the issue of Free Greens, which he (and PPD) think has created the situation they are trying to fix; therefore they won’t be issuing free greens.

    Zollie went on to suggest that with Project Payday’s endorsement of the Anything4Free, which uses a more traditional approach, older (veteran) members of Project Payday will still find a better trading environment than they may have known recently.

    Zollie also stated that NIS cannot turn back time and solve all the issues that confront the Freebie business.

    I was surprised that Zollie was not more receptive to the idea of paid greens, as it would have the same impact as greening the 10 sites. I used an analogy of a free concert vs. a concert that costs just $5 for admission…you would be amazed how many people stay away (that would have walked in) simply because of the $5 fee…and of course, the higher the fee, the less people that go to the concert. I don’t remember this (maybe I am too new to the business), but Zollie stated that some networks have used paid greens in the past, and what was even more common was swapping an unpaid green in lieu of fulfilling the offer requirements. Zollie said that these were a precursor to free greens. In his view, he thinks that except for making a little money on the front end, a paid green doesn't help the big problem of people using Method 2 right away without first completing offers. While I agree that for new people, his system makes sense (although clearly it should be open to all networks); a very suitable solution for veterans would be the paid greens. Zollie thinks that we (current Method 2 traders) are no worse off than we were before PPD switched its focus.

    In conclusion, I would just say that I offered to pay whatever Zollie makes from the affiliates for 1 referral for all 10 sites in order to be allowed to post in the paying for referrals forum. This is exactly the same money in Zollie’s pocket as if I greened the 10 sites. The fact that he would not accept this as a reasonable solution tells me that something else (much bigger) is going on here. I’m not sure what it is exactly, but what’s the difference between the 10 greens or the payment in cash equal to the exact same amount? I’m a veteran trader, so it’s not like I won’t be able to help my referrals go green or anything like that. The only thing I can think of is that this a pure power play to see if PPD generates enough traffic to put the other (or at least some other) freebie networks out of business because of the “exclusivity” aspect of NIS. Also, if this was to happen, it of course would follow that FLR and A4F would likely be in trouble as well as they would have fewer networks to trade on.

    I hope this helps everyone here get a little better understanding of what’s going on with all this. I’d love to hear your thoughts. Thanks.

    -Don

  • Don

    Leslie – Thanks for the great information regarding all the changes going on at PPD lately – as always, your information is both timely and extremely helpful. I recently asked Zollie (Ferrell) about the details of NIS and PPD as it relates to the freebie industry, I thought it would be useful for the community here if I posted a summary of our conversation (via PM) so here it is:

    I had asked if there is a place for me at NIS, since I have greened about 40 sites personally, how would there be a place for me if I was now expected to green another 10 Z Best Freebies sites (without even being allowed to see the offers first)? While I was aware that Free Greens in the industry have become excessive, leading to significant oversupply of unqualified Method 2 traders, paid greens would go a long way to correcting the situation going forward – and I would think would be at least as effective as the “green 10 sites before you can pay for referrals” rule. Zollie essentially said that NIS was created to address the issue of Free Greens, which he (and PPD) think has created the situation they are trying to fix; therefore they won’t be issuing free greens.

    Zollie went on to suggest that with Project Payday’s endorsement of the Anything4Free, which uses a more traditional approach, older (veteran) members of Project Payday will still find a better trading environment than they may have known recently.

    Zollie also stated that NIS cannot turn back time and solve all the issues that confront the Freebie business.

    I was surprised that Zollie was not more receptive to the idea of paid greens, as it would have the same impact as greening the 10 sites. I used an analogy of a free concert vs. a concert that costs just $5 for admission…you would be amazed how many people stay away (that would have walked in) simply because of the $5 fee…and of course, the higher the fee, the less people that go to the concert. I don’t remember this (maybe I am too new to the business), but Zollie stated that some networks have used paid greens in the past, and what was even more common was swapping an unpaid green in lieu of fulfilling the offer requirements. Zollie said that these were a precursor to free greens. In his view, he thinks that except for making a little money on the front end, a paid green doesn't help the big problem of people using Method 2 right away without first completing offers. While I agree that for new people, his system makes sense (although clearly it should be open to all networks); a very suitable solution for veterans would be the paid greens. Zollie thinks that we (current Method 2 traders) are no worse off than we were before PPD switched its focus.

    In conclusion, I would just say that I offered to pay whatever Zollie makes from the affiliates for 1 referral for all 10 sites in order to be allowed to post in the paying for referrals forum. This is exactly the same money in Zollie’s pocket as if I greened the 10 sites. The fact that he would not accept this as a reasonable solution tells me that something else (much bigger) is going on here. I’m not sure what it is exactly, but what’s the difference between the 10 greens or the payment in cash equal to the exact same amount? I’m a veteran trader, so it’s not like I won’t be able to help my referrals go green or anything like that. The only thing I can think of is that this a pure power play to see if PPD generates enough traffic to put the other (or at least some other) freebie networks out of business because of the “exclusivity” aspect of NIS. Also, if this was to happen, it of course would follow that FLR and A4F would likely be in trouble as well as they would have fewer networks to trade on.

    I hope this helps everyone here get a little better understanding of what’s going on with all this. I’d love to hear your thoughts. Thanks.

    -Don

  • MacroBucks

    FLR and A4F aren't going out of business. Solutions will be found and placed.

    In my opinion - anything being said about "correcting" the freebie industry is simply used to mask the truth (profit). Sure, things could be better - but can't things be better in every industry? And you know why we aren't in a perfect economic situation in this industry? Because it's impossible per the most basic rules of macro economics. In a free market (or any market), there is no perfect market condition. This is just the way a free market economy works. Many Site Owners have been congregating for the past 2 months on trying to cooperate and cut down on the free greens (especially for the newbies who just go for it because it's free) - a MUCH better approach than what's going on right now. And anyhow, I believe whatever is being said to justify what has happened is to cover up the obvious truth - money.

    Can PPD or Zollie JUSTIFY why they've decided to abruptly cut off the incomes of more than 20,000+ people? Many of those simply CANNOT complete 10 Zbest sites and pay $30 in hopes of being able to trade on NIS for restricted sites. People who depend on traditional forums to obtain referrals to pay off their phone bill, gas expenses, mortgages, or even put food on their families plates are completely put in the dark completely and shut out from most of their incomes (hopefully not for long). If I was either of them, I would be filled with this guilt that would never leave me for the rest of my life - but i'm an ethical person and can relate/understand to the plight of others.

    I think it's fairly obvious why all of this was done and I don't want to call them out anymore than I already have, but the clear answer is money. Their actions show they didn't give a second thought to their previous loyal users.

    I pray to God that users at the forums will be able to hold on tight for now and none of them will be negatively influenced by the ignorant and short-sighted decision of a few.

    For now, everyone hold on tight. As a group effort, we'll get through this and make it better than before.

    • MacroBucks

      I was just informed that it is now changed to 5 sites on Zbest to trade. Still doesn't change much, but yeah, didn't want to leave the misinformation.

    • MacroBucks

      I was just informed that it is now changed to 5 sites on Zbest to trade. Still doesn't change much, but yeah, didn't want to leave the misinformation.

  • MacroBucks

    FLR and A4F aren't going out of business. Solutions will be found and placed.

    In my opinion - anything being said about "correcting" the freebie industry is simply used to mask the truth (profit). Sure, things could be better - but can't things be better in every industry? And you know why we aren't in a perfect economic situation in this industry? Because it's impossible per the most basic rules of macro economics. In a free market (or any market), there is no perfect market condition. This is just the way a free market economy works. Many Site Owners have been congregating for the past 2 months on trying to cooperate and cut down on the free greens (especially for the newbies who just go for it because it's free) - a MUCH better approach than what's going on right now. And anyhow, I believe whatever is being said to justify what has happened is to cover up the obvious truth - money.

    Can PPD or Zollie JUSTIFY why they've decided to abruptly cut off the incomes of more than 20,000+ people? Many of those simply CANNOT complete 10 Zbest sites and pay $30 in hopes of being able to trade on NIS for restricted sites. People who depend on traditional forums to obtain referrals to pay off their phone bill, gas expenses, mortgages, or even put food on their families plates are completely put in the dark completely and shut out from most of their incomes (hopefully not for long). If I was either of them, I would be filled with this guilt that would never leave me for the rest of my life - but i'm an ethical person and can relate/understand to the plight of others.

    I think it's fairly obvious why all of this was done and I don't want to call them out anymore than I already have, but the clear answer is money. Their actions show they didn't give a second thought to their previous loyal users.

    I pray to God that users at the forums will be able to hold on tight for now and none of them will be negatively influenced by the ignorant and short-sighted decision of a few.

    For now, everyone hold on tight. As a group effort, we'll get through this and make it better than before.

  • MacroBucks

    FLR and A4F aren't going out of business. Solutions will be found and placed.

    In my opinion - anything being said about "correcting" the freebie industry is simply used to mask the truth (profit). Sure, things could be better - but can't things be better in every industry? And you know why we aren't in a perfect economic situation in this industry? Because it's impossible per the most basic rules of macro economics. In a free market (or any market), there is no perfect market condition. This is just the way a free market economy works. Many Site Owners have been congregating for the past 2 months on trying to cooperate and cut down on the free greens (especially for the newbies who just go for it because it's free) - a MUCH better approach than what's going on right now. And anyhow, I believe whatever is being said to justify what has happened is to cover up the obvious truth - money.

    Can PPD or Zollie JUSTIFY why they've decided to abruptly cut off the incomes of more than 20,000+ people? Many of those simply CANNOT complete 10 Zbest sites and pay $30 in hopes of being able to trade on NIS for restricted sites. People who depend on traditional forums to obtain referrals to pay off their phone bill, gas expenses, mortgages, or even put food on their families plates are completely put in the dark completely and shut out from most of their incomes (hopefully not for long). If I was either of them, I would be filled with this guilt that would never leave me for the rest of my life - but i'm an ethical person and can relate/understand to the plight of others.

    I think it's fairly obvious why all of this was done and I don't want to call them out anymore than I already have, but the clear answer is money. Their actions show they didn't give a second thought to their previous loyal users.

    I pray to God that users at the forums will be able to hold on tight for now and none of them will be negatively influenced by the ignorant and short-sighted decision of a few.

    For now, everyone hold on tight. As a group effort, we'll get through this and make it better than before.

    • MacroBucks

      I was just informed that it is now changed to 5 sites on Zbest to trade. Still doesn't change much, but yeah, didn't want to leave the misinformation.

  • SBDowntown

    Leslie, I just wanted to thank you for always posting such thoughtful and well-organized info on your blog. I have read a lot about this PPD change and the new NIS on FreeLunchroom, and the threads can get sort of out of control with everyone's opinions, and some people posting who truly don't know what they're talking about...Whenever I come up with a question about something in the freebie world, I can often come here and find answers clearly spelled out--and if not answers, at least thoughtful and considerate opinions. That is why I love your blog and try to check it often.

    As for PPD, NIS, and all these entities undergoing such drastic changes, I truly wish us all the best, including myself. I am a fairly loyal FLR user and don't plan to change anytime soon, if I can continue to make money there. FLR has announced major marketing to come, which, according to FLR Admin, will bring even more traffic to FLR than PPD ever did. This remains to be seen, but I am hopeful and optimistic about that. I learned about freebie trading from PPD, and while their new direction seems a little shaky to me, I do wish them the best with what they're doing, because were it not for PPD, I likely wouldn't have found freebies in the first place, so I do wish them continued success. It is unlikely that I will use NIS or ZBest sites, I'm not really in a position to green many sites at this time, and when I do green a site, I want it to be on my terms, not in a desperate attempt to get on the A-list on NIS.

    This new PPD program may work well for new folks, but those of us who have been greening sites for awhile are basically out of luck. I look to see the policies of NIS change with time. I just don't think their current policy will be able to work long-term.

  • SBDowntown

    Leslie, I just wanted to thank you for always posting such thoughtful and well-organized info on your blog. I have read a lot about this PPD change and the new NIS on FreeLunchroom, and the threads can get sort of out of control with everyone's opinions, and some people posting who truly don't know what they're talking about...Whenever I come up with a question about something in the freebie world, I can often come here and find answers clearly spelled out--and if not answers, at least thoughtful and considerate opinions. That is why I love your blog and try to check it often.

    As for PPD, NIS, and all these entities undergoing such drastic changes, I truly wish us all the best, including myself. I am a fairly loyal FLR user and don't plan to change anytime soon, if I can continue to make money there. FLR has announced major marketing to come, which, according to FLR Admin, will bring even more traffic to FLR than PPD ever did. This remains to be seen, but I am hopeful and optimistic about that. I learned about freebie trading from PPD, and while their new direction seems a little shaky to me, I do wish them the best with what they're doing, because were it not for PPD, I likely wouldn't have found freebies in the first place, so I do wish them continued success. It is unlikely that I will use NIS or ZBest sites, I'm not really in a position to green many sites at this time, and when I do green a site, I want it to be on my terms, not in a desperate attempt to get on the A-list on NIS.

    This new PPD program may work well for new folks, but those of us who have been greening sites for awhile are basically out of luck. I look to see the policies of NIS change with time. I just don't think their current policy will be able to work long-term.

  • SBDowntown

    Leslie, I just wanted to thank you for always posting such thoughtful and well-organized info on your blog. I have read a lot about this PPD change and the new NIS on FreeLunchroom, and the threads can get sort of out of control with everyone's opinions, and some people posting who truly don't know what they're talking about...Whenever I come up with a question about something in the freebie world, I can often come here and find answers clearly spelled out--and if not answers, at least thoughtful and considerate opinions. That is why I love your blog and try to check it often.

    As for PPD, NIS, and all these entities undergoing such drastic changes, I truly wish us all the best, including myself. I am a fairly loyal FLR user and don't plan to change anytime soon, if I can continue to make money there. FLR has announced major marketing to come, which, according to FLR Admin, will bring even more traffic to FLR than PPD ever did. This remains to be seen, but I am hopeful and optimistic about that. I learned about freebie trading from PPD, and while their new direction seems a little shaky to me, I do wish them the best with what they're doing, because were it not for PPD, I likely wouldn't have found freebies in the first place, so I do wish them continued success. It is unlikely that I will use NIS or ZBest sites, I'm not really in a position to green many sites at this time, and when I do green a site, I want it to be on my terms, not in a desperate attempt to get on the A-list on NIS.

    This new PPD program may work well for new folks, but those of us who have been greening sites for awhile are basically out of luck. I look to see the policies of NIS change with time. I just don't think their current policy will be able to work long-term.

  • http://swiftrewards.net/ SwiftRewards

    One correction: PPD is still sending traffic to A4F, just not to FLR.

    Also, I personally diagree with two of your three observations:

    1. Yes, the number of new sites popping up can cause quality to go down, but is ZBestFreebies a quality site? I won't make that judgment, but I don't think this factor played into PPD's decision at all.

    2. Promotions: Yep, it's out of hand, and yep it causes offer weights to go down. But what will cause them to go down further is when you have no competition. I haven't looked at ZMan's offer weights - they may be good - but lack of competition generally tends to breed poor quality and complacency.

    On a side note, I have been tracking the number of new signups at A4F and FLR, for about 2-3 weeks. Each day the number of new members at A4F is between 50-100% more than that of FLR. Leo has made very bold claims of doubling traffic (I wouldn't hold my breath), but I can see tides shifting. It's happened before. Look at FIPG. They're basically dead. Meanwhile even smaller forums like TheFreebieExchange are doing pretty good. I saw the number of online members at 120 the last time I was there, which isn't a whole lot lower than A4F or FLR typically has.

    Back on topic though, I really don't know what PPD was thinking, but freebies have thrived before PPD and will after.

    (End of rambling...)

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      Hey Jeremy, thanks for the comments. I did say in the post that PPD still sends traffic to A4F. However, the A4F info is harder to find. And in terms of your points of disagreements:
      1. I never said ZBestFreebies is a quality site. I have never used them. I don't like how they look, and can't speak for their quality.
      2. That is also very true. I said that I don't agree with everything they are doing and that is DEFINITELY one of the things I think that doesn't make any sense.

      Yeah, TheFreebieExchange seems to be ding pretty good and I hope to see them grow significantly.

      What was PPD thinking? I'm not sure, but like you, I am sure that Freebies will thrive!!

      • http://swiftrewards.net/ SwiftRewards

        I guess I shouldn't have said that I disagree with your observations, because your observations are dead-on, what I actually meant is that while those things *are* issues, I disagree that "PPD and NIS are responding to" those. I think it's apparent to all of us (including yourself) that PPD's only interest is themselves, and not any industry trends or issues. At least not at this point. When they cut ties with FLR (they cut the ties, not vice-versa, and I can ensure you that it was abrupt), it seemed to be because they authentically wanted to help the industry. They claimed it was because of the myriad things going on behind the scenes over at FLR, such as Leo's heavy-handedness with site owners, and the banning of affiliate networks for personal gain and personal vendettas (PPD, btw, is owned by an affiliate network, and *they* hadn't tried to take advantage of that, so the fact that Leo attempted to restrict what networks people could use, based on bribes, was surely irritating to PPD). From what I hear, they talked seriously of essentially dropping A4F into FLR's position, so this recent turn is quite a shock. I can only imagine that somewhere along the line they've seen dollar signs.
        I think what the industry needs is to go back to our roots, and that's to make freebies about free stuff again, and about fun, not just about profit. Because I think this current atmosphere is what breeds corruption. When people are in it just for the money, you can't expect them to always put others' best interests first and to behave ethically. Sure we're all in it for the money to a point -- me, you, FLR, PPD -- but when it becomes more about self gain than simply loving the industry and wanting to be a part of it (or more likely, on top of it), then that's when things turn bad. We've gone from ambition (wanting to be successful, or simply wanting to get that free iPod) to the

        • SwiftRewards

          Oops, I thought I had deleted that last sentence fragment...

        • SwiftRewards

          Oops, I thought I had deleted that last sentence fragment...

        • SwiftRewards

          Oh, and "assure", not "ensure" *sigh*

      • http://swiftrewards.net/ SwiftRewards

        I guess I shouldn't have said that I disagree with your observations, because your observations are dead-on, what I actually meant is that while those things *are* issues, I disagree that "PPD and NIS are responding to" those. I think it's apparent to all of us (including yourself) that PPD's only interest is themselves, and not any industry trends or issues. At least not at this point. When they cut ties with FLR (they cut the ties, not vice-versa, and I can ensure you that it was abrupt), it seemed to be because they authentically wanted to help the industry. They claimed it was because of the myriad things going on behind the scenes over at FLR, such as Leo's heavy-handedness with site owners, and the banning of affiliate networks for personal gain and personal vendettas (PPD, btw, is owned by an affiliate network, and *they* hadn't tried to take advantage of that, so the fact that Leo attempted to restrict what networks people could use, based on bribes, was surely irritating to PPD). From what I hear, they talked seriously of essentially dropping A4F into FLR's position, so this recent turn is quite a shock. I can only imagine that somewhere along the line they've seen dollar signs.
        I think what the industry needs is to go back to our roots, and that's to make freebies about free stuff again, and about fun, not just about profit. Because I think this current atmosphere is what breeds corruption. When people are in it just for the money, you can't expect them to always put others' best interests first and to behave ethically. Sure we're all in it for the money to a point -- me, you, FLR, PPD -- but when it becomes more about self gain than simply loving the industry and wanting to be a part of it (or more likely, on top of it), then that's when things turn bad. We've gone from ambition (wanting to be successful, or simply wanting to get that free iPod) to the

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      Hey Jeremy, thanks for the comments. I did say in the post that PPD still sends traffic to A4F. However, the A4F info is harder to find. And in terms of your points of disagreements:
      1. I never said ZBestFreebies is a quality site. I have never used them. I don't like how they look, and can't speak for their quality.
      2. That is also very true. I said that I don't agree with everything they are doing and that is DEFINITELY one of the things I think that doesn't make any sense.

      Yeah, TheFreebieExchange seems to be ding pretty good and I hope to see them grow significantly.

      What was PPD thinking? I'm not sure, but like you, I am sure that Freebies will thrive!!

  • http://swiftrewards.net SwiftRewards

    One correction: PPD is still sending traffic to A4F, just not to FLR.

    Also, I personally diagree with two of your three observations:

    1. Yes, the number of new sites popping up can cause quality to go down, but is ZBestFreebies a quality site? I won't make that judgment, but I don't think this factor played into PPD's decision at all.

    2. Promotions: Yep, it's out of hand, and yep it causes offer weights to go down. But what will cause them to go down further is when you have no competition. I haven't looked at ZMan's offer weights - they may be good - but lack of competition generally tends to breed poor quality and complacency.

    On a side note, I have been tracking the number of new signups at A4F and FLR, for about 2-3 weeks. Each day the number of new members at A4F is between 50-100% more than that of FLR. Leo has made very bold claims of doubling traffic (I wouldn't hold my breath), but I can see tides shifting. It's happened before. Look at FIPG. They're basically dead. Meanwhile even smaller forums like TheFreebieExchange are doing pretty good. I saw the number of online members at 120 the last time I was there, which isn't a whole lot lower than A4F or FLR typically has.

    Back on topic though, I really don't know what PPD was thinking, but freebies have thrived before PPD and will after.

    (End of rambling...)

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie

      Hey Jeremy, thanks for the comments. I did say in the post that PPD still sends traffic to A4F. However, the A4F info is harder to find. And in terms of your points of disagreements:
      1. I never said ZBestFreebies is a quality site. I have never used them. I don't like how they look, and can't speak for their quality.
      2. That is also very true. I said that I don't agree with everything they are doing and that is DEFINITELY one of the things I think that doesn't make any sense.

      Yeah, TheFreebieExchange seems to be ding pretty good and I hope to see them grow significantly.

      What was PPD thinking? I'm not sure, but like you, I am sure that Freebies will thrive!!

      • http://swiftrewards.net SwiftRewards

        I guess I shouldn't have said that I disagree with your observations, because your observations are dead-on, what I actually meant is that while those things *are* issues, I disagree that "PPD and NIS are responding to" those. I think it's apparent to all of us (including yourself) that PPD's only interest is themselves, and not any industry trends or issues. At least not at this point. When they cut ties with FLR (they cut the ties, not vice-versa, and I can ensure you that it was abrupt), it seemed to be because they authentically wanted to help the industry. They claimed it was because of the myriad things going on behind the scenes over at FLR, such as Leo's heavy-handedness with site owners, and the banning of affiliate networks for personal gain and personal vendettas (PPD, btw, is owned by an affiliate network, and *they* hadn't tried to take advantage of that, so the fact that Leo attempted to restrict what networks people could use, based on bribes, was surely irritating to PPD). From what I hear, they talked seriously of essentially dropping A4F into FLR's position, so this recent turn is quite a shock. I can only imagine that somewhere along the line they've seen dollar signs.
        I think what the industry needs is to go back to our roots, and that's to make freebies about free stuff again, and about fun, not just about profit. Because I think this current atmosphere is what breeds corruption. When people are in it just for the money, you can't expect them to always put others' best interests first and to behave ethically. Sure we're all in it for the money to a point -- me, you, FLR, PPD -- but when it becomes more about self gain than simply loving the industry and wanting to be a part of it (or more likely, on top of it), then that's when things turn bad. We've gone from ambition (wanting to be successful, or simply wanting to get that free iPod) to the

        • SwiftRewards

          Oops, I thought I had deleted that last sentence fragment...

        • SwiftRewards

          Oh, and "assure", not "ensure" *sigh*

  • Shannon

    I'm going to have to agree with Macrobucks and Swiftrewards on this one. I understand the concept they are trying to do with not allowing free greens and having strict requirements to be "mentors" on the NIS forum, but I believe the bigger underlying issue for both PPD and NIS is profit. For one Kelly is going to be making a huge profit being the 1st person that most of these newbies trade with. 2nd Zollie is going to make a huge profit because the most obvious forum that PPD is routing to is his and he owns the sites at his forum so he will be making the profit there. On the traders side, I really hope that Zollie's sites have good quality because it could ruin freebie trading for newbies if they have a bad first experience. Anyone who has the possibility to complete that many offers to complete all of his sites are also going to have an advantage being one of the few people who can be a mentor at his forum. That is a lot of traffic being filtered to a few people. I almost wish I had the capability to do that many offers just to get in for that traffic. Much higher newbie to trader ratio then say FLR because FLR has so many members. Other than that I think it is a bad move for the freebie industry in general because it discourages free market and forces people to only use 1 network. The other problem I have with the Zbestfreebies network is that I have worked with newbies that have been taken advantage of by him when he was trading on FLR. I don't like his tactics which would steer me away from his sites anyways.

    • MacroBucks

      I think we'll see work themselves out. Don't worry too much! A solution is coming (after all we're talking about lost business for a ton of site owners and forum owners - of course things will happen).

    • MacroBucks

      I think we'll see work themselves out. Don't worry too much! A solution is coming (after all we're talking about lost business for a ton of site owners and forum owners - of course things will happen).

  • Shannon

    I'm going to have to agree with Macrobucks and Swiftrewards on this one. I understand the concept they are trying to do with not allowing free greens and having strict requirements to be "mentors" on the NIS forum, but I believe the bigger underlying issue for both PPD and NIS is profit. For one Kelly is going to be making a huge profit being the 1st person that most of these newbies trade with. 2nd Zollie is going to make a huge profit because the most obvious forum that PPD is routing to is his and he owns the sites at his forum so he will be making the profit there. On the traders side, I really hope that Zollie's sites have good quality because it could ruin freebie trading for newbies if they have a bad first experience. Anyone who has the possibility to complete that many offers to complete all of his sites are also going to have an advantage being one of the few people who can be a mentor at his forum. That is a lot of traffic being filtered to a few people. I almost wish I had the capability to do that many offers just to get in for that traffic. Much higher newbie to trader ratio then say FLR because FLR has so many members. Other than that I think it is a bad move for the freebie industry in general because it discourages free market and forces people to only use 1 network. The other problem I have with the Zbestfreebies network is that I have worked with newbies that have been taken advantage of by him when he was trading on FLR. I don't like his tactics which would steer me away from his sites anyways.

    • MacroBucks

      I think we'll see work themselves out. Don't worry too much! A solution is coming (after all we're talking about lost business for a ton of site owners and forum owners - of course things will happen).

  • http://www.Git-R-Free.com/ Git-R-Free

    I agree with the Free Greens being out of hand, and the sheer # of promotions some sites do at the same time is simply out of control. Although many sites have slight disputes with each other. A general overall agreement or "Standard" is most likely going to have to be agreed upon and met. Some site owners run their sites as a full-time business/job while others are doing it for extra money while they are at college. The problem is those who are doing it simply for extra money can really play a toll on those who are trying to maintain an honest business. In one aspect it's just competition, in another it leans towards who is going to pay the most for their customers, rather than who can provide the most quality site for their customers. I do believe that once a few consecutive fraud issues come into play with these site owners they seriously are going to be hurting, which unfortuantely can hurt unsuspecting users as well. We spend more on fraud protection every month, rather than running 2-3 additional promos, as it's a constant struggle that needs to be watched, advanced, and secured as much as possible if a site plans on being around for awhile. Those who don't I just can't seem to take seriously anymore. I can see what PPD is doing, as many here though I'm not going to agree with it, but that is their choice not ours I guess.

    • A

      This industry is run by young people - not only this one, but affiliate marketing in general is run by young people. I think your comments are a bit misinformed when you talk about college kids trying to make "extra money." I believe most people in this business are looking to make a career out of it than just extra money.

      As much as those promotions can get out of hand with buying users - this is a free market and is following the correct economic cycle as such. Can't beat the fundamental theories of economics.

      • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

        I think what he is referring to is not college kids in general, but those that are in it just for "extra money" and don't view it as a serious business. I'm sure he has no problem with college kids running a business, as long as they are doing it well

      • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

        I think what he is referring to is not college kids in general, but those that are in it just for "extra money" and don't view it as a serious business. I'm sure he has no problem with college kids running a business, as long as they are doing it well

  • http://www.Git-R-Free.com Git-R-Free

    I agree with the Free Greens being out of hand, and the sheer # of promotions some sites do at the same time is simply out of control. Although many sites have slight disputes with each other. A general overall agreement or "Standard" is most likely going to have to be agreed upon and met. Some site owners run their sites as a full-time business/job while others are doing it for extra money while they are at college. The problem is those who are doing it simply for extra money can really play a toll on those who are trying to maintain an honest business. In one aspect it's just competition, in another it leans towards who is going to pay the most for their customers, rather than who can provide the most quality site for their customers. I do believe that once a few consecutive fraud issues come into play with these site owners they seriously are going to be hurting, which unfortuantely can hurt unsuspecting users as well. We spend more on fraud protection every month, rather than running 2-3 additional promos, as it's a constant struggle that needs to be watched, advanced, and secured as much as possible if a site plans on being around for awhile. Those who don't I just can't seem to take seriously anymore. I can see what PPD is doing, as many here though I'm not going to agree with it, but that is their choice not ours I guess.

    • A

      This industry is run by young people - not only this one, but affiliate marketing in general is run by young people. I think your comments are a bit misinformed when you talk about college kids trying to make "extra money." I believe most people in this business are looking to make a career out of it than just extra money.

      As much as those promotions can get out of hand with buying users - this is a free market and is following the correct economic cycle as such. Can't beat the fundamental theories of economics.

      • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie

        I think what he is referring to is not college kids in general, but those that are in it just for "extra money" and don't view it as a serious business. I'm sure he has no problem with college kids running a business, as long as they are doing it well

  • http://www.ifwmentor.com/ ifw mentor

    Hello Leslie,

    first I would like to say, you always have very interesting news for us in the freebie industry, so we thank you for that.

    I did check out PPD when things first changed with the forum I was directed to via PPD. I really didn't know what had happened to cause the separation between the two and of course there were all types of opinions flying around the forums, so I figured I would check thing s out myself. Now I can understand PPD's decision to make the change as a business decision to make PPD even a higher profitable business. But I disagree with their ethics of doing so. It's kind of like a scam per say because PPD promoted their 10 trade policy of once a new trader has successfully completed 10 trades then that trader had met PPD's requirement to be certified as a PPD Mentor. Now in my thinking, if they certify you as a mentor, then unless you do something to change that status, then you should be able to continue gaining the rewards as a PPD Mentor. Now because they decided to break off with the Free Lunch Rooms, that shouldn't effect My status with PPD because they are the ones who promoted and sent me to FLR. However, I decided to head one over to NIS and register the Forum and continue as always. But then I got the, welcome email and a few PM's from Zack stating that I had to go through their training to be able to post their forum and Mentor other new traders coming through. Now this confused me because that same day, PPD had assigned me to Mentor new traders on the FLR. So I asked the question: Why would I have to go through your training to be a mentor, when you had already certified me as a mentor. But not only that, but you are/were still sending me new traders to mentor. So of course I was confused and I'm sure you can understand why. So in my eyes what I see is either PPD is taking this opportunity to weed out some of the veteran trades in order to bring in new, or it's just an attempt to corner the market and profit as much as possible before it catches up with them.(Greed).

    Free Greens, well I think this is devastating to the industry as a whole. Being a seasoned trader I have had so many new traders come to me totally upset and about ready to walk away from this opportunity because they had gotten with the wrong person/so called Mentor, that really didn't know but a little more than them and had gotten them in deep trouble with offer shortage. Some had gotten in trouble so deep that in order for them to succeed they would basically have to be out tons of money to reach or gain the knowledge it would take to become a worthy trader themselves. There's traders with 2, 3 and in some cases even less that's proclaiming to be a mentor. And to put it simple, they ARE NOT. A mentor knows the order a new trader need to take in order to achieve the necessary greens to become a well rounded trader. And those with so few trades have no idea what that is because they never educated themselves enough to know. So I agree, there has to be a handle put on the free greens before the negativity from those that failed reach others that are interested in becoming a freebie trader. I mean, like if the sites keep giving out free greens they way they are giving them, who's going to be available to actually sample the products? I know right now that part of the aspect seems very small right now, but it is growing. I've seen so many trade threads promoting: Let me show you how to get 100's of sites like the veteran traders have so you can start referring people and make the kind of money I do. Mind you, the traders I seen promoting this had 4 or less trades themselves. lol So to say make the money they have made isn't worth wasting their times on. I will say, that by the time a trader has around 7 or 8 trades, then they're more than likely ready to refer their friends or family as a start.

    To sum it all up in my eyes, PPD need to rethink their policies of what qualifies a trader as a mentor coming to their forum or, it will all hit them in the face.

    And the sites, Need to rethink their policies of giving out all these free greens. Without the free greens, they will still get the flow of referrals they normally get, because now, instead of that new trader getting the free greens, they will have to earn them just like Myself and most veterans earned theirs. Or at least only issue the free greens once they have completed the 10 trades required to be recognized as a mentor.

    Keep up the great work Leslie,
    And Blessings To All,
    Lonnie

  • http://www.ifwmentor.com ifw mentor

    Hello Leslie,

    first I would like to say, you always have very interesting news for us in the freebie industry, so we thank you for that.

    I did check out PPD when things first changed with the forum I was directed to via PPD. I really didn't know what had happened to cause the separation between the two and of course there were all types of opinions flying around the forums, so I figured I would check thing s out myself. Now I can understand PPD's decision to make the change as a business decision to make PPD even a higher profitable business. But I disagree with their ethics of doing so. It's kind of like a scam per say because PPD promoted their 10 trade policy of once a new trader has successfully completed 10 trades then that trader had met PPD's requirement to be certified as a PPD Mentor. Now in my thinking, if they certify you as a mentor, then unless you do something to change that status, then you should be able to continue gaining the rewards as a PPD Mentor. Now because they decided to break off with the Free Lunch Rooms, that shouldn't effect My status with PPD because they are the ones who promoted and sent me to FLR. However, I decided to head one over to NIS and register the Forum and continue as always. But then I got the, welcome email and a few PM's from Zack stating that I had to go through their training to be able to post their forum and Mentor other new traders coming through. Now this confused me because that same day, PPD had assigned me to Mentor new traders on the FLR. So I asked the question: Why would I have to go through your training to be a mentor, when you had already certified me as a mentor. But not only that, but you are/were still sending me new traders to mentor. So of course I was confused and I'm sure you can understand why. So in my eyes what I see is either PPD is taking this opportunity to weed out some of the veteran trades in order to bring in new, or it's just an attempt to corner the market and profit as much as possible before it catches up with them.(Greed).

    Free Greens, well I think this is devastating to the industry as a whole. Being a seasoned trader I have had so many new traders come to me totally upset and about ready to walk away from this opportunity because they had gotten with the wrong person/so called Mentor, that really didn't know but a little more than them and had gotten them in deep trouble with offer shortage. Some had gotten in trouble so deep that in order for them to succeed they would basically have to be out tons of money to reach or gain the knowledge it would take to become a worthy trader themselves. There's traders with 2, 3 and in some cases even less that's proclaiming to be a mentor. And to put it simple, they ARE NOT. A mentor knows the order a new trader need to take in order to achieve the necessary greens to become a well rounded trader. And those with so few trades have no idea what that is because they never educated themselves enough to know. So I agree, there has to be a handle put on the free greens before the negativity from those that failed reach others that are interested in becoming a freebie trader. I mean, like if the sites keep giving out free greens they way they are giving them, who's going to be available to actually sample the products? I know right now that part of the aspect seems very small right now, but it is growing. I've seen so many trade threads promoting: Let me show you how to get 100's of sites like the veteran traders have so you can start referring people and make the kind of money I do. Mind you, the traders I seen promoting this had 4 or less trades themselves. lol So to say make the money they have made isn't worth wasting their times on. I will say, that by the time a trader has around 7 or 8 trades, then they're more than likely ready to refer their friends or family as a start.

    To sum it all up in my eyes, PPD need to rethink their policies of what qualifies a trader as a mentor coming to their forum or, it will all hit them in the face.

    And the sites, Need to rethink their policies of giving out all these free greens. Without the free greens, they will still get the flow of referrals they normally get, because now, instead of that new trader getting the free greens, they will have to earn them just like Myself and most veterans earned theirs. Or at least only issue the free greens once they have completed the 10 trades required to be recognized as a mentor.

    Keep up the great work Leslie,
    And Blessings To All,
    Lonnie

  • Gem Alfred

    Even though I am not yet a Freebie Trader I am thankful that Im updated on what is happening in the Freebie world.

  • Gem Alfred

    Even though I am not yet a Freebie Trader I am thankful that Im updated on what is happening in the Freebie world.

  • Gem Alfred

    Even though I am not yet a Freebie Trader I am thankful that Im updated on what is happening in the Freebie world.

  • john

    Hello everyone,, I am new at trading thing I STARTED YESTERDAY WITH GOING AND BUYING SOMETHING ON PROJECT PAY DAY AND IT LEANT ME TO NIS i TOOK TODAY TO PONDER THE IDEA OF BANGINGOUT HTESE GREENS FOR A PROFIT A 75 DOLLARS IF IM LUCK AND SOME OTHER THINGS THEN i had a idea!! I wante to know from you well groomed traders the abcs of the business i got the concept but i cant see the guys behind the doors that hold the money where does it begin the way i see it is these companies pay a guy who? and inturn pays lets say the guy who pays zollie and then there is the trader and then there is me plain joe working the greens is that how it works? But most important will there evercome a time when the money runs out ? and who decides this? I AM LOOKING TO GO GUN HO AT THIS BUT i had a few questions 1
    1 Can you get paid over and over again for referals

    2 If so is there a cap on this?

    3 Can I go green on the same sight twice?

    4. Can I have 4000 referals done in one day and if so will i get paid for them... and o another thing lets say I HAVE PEOPLE WHO WILL SAY SIT DOWN AND GO GREEN ON 6 SITES IN 4 HOURS INSTEAD OF USING THEM FOR MY OWN REFERAL CAN i JUST SELL THIS OUT RIGHT TO PEOPLE LIKE YOU?

    i would like to say hi again and would gladly appreciate any feed back on these questions with also some do and dont info if you got the time!! I t may be the thing that got u a reliable colleeg but if not a friend for the look over thanks and god bless

    Military vet saying thanks and god bless

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      Hi John, it seems like you are doing your due diligence and I applaud that. To answer your questions specifically:
      1. Yes you get paid over and over again as long as you continue to get referrals as long as the site is forever green and repeatable. This means that once you complete the offer requirements and are green, you can send referrals over and over and cash out for each greened referral.
      2. I believe there is a cap on everything. I'm not sure what exactly the cap would be on Freebie Trading because I've never seen anyone reach it (or even close to it). It all boils down to how much the advertisers are willing to pay. They have marketing budgets and there are many factors that go into determining what portion of that budget will go into paying for individuals to try out their service/product.
      3. You can never go green on the same site twice. That's against the Terms of Service. However, there is no real need to go green on the same site multiple times. The real money is when you move on to method 2, where you are just getting referrals. Also, most networks have multiple sites, and Zbestfreebies is one that has multiple sites. So, for example, if you go green on Paypal ZBestFreebies, you can still go green at football ZBestFreebies. In the same way, if you go green at 40 Macrobucks, you can go green at 60 Macrobucks with no problem. Those are all different sites.
      4. As long as they are valid leads, yes you should get paid for them. That would be a huge number of referrals in one day, but as long as you can manage to get that many referrals to go green you can get paid. The one major problem there would be is that you would have to take the time to train all those referrals or have a system in place to train them. That aspect is not as easy as it might seem. And yes, you can sell those referrals to people like me, but you would only get paid if their green turns out to be legitimate. Also, if you are doing that, you need to make sure that you aren't doing it at a trading forum where it isn't allowed.

      Hope that has answered your questions. If you have anymore, do not hesitate to ask.

      Blessings to you too!

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      Hi John, it seems like you are doing your due diligence and I applaud that. To answer your questions specifically:
      1. Yes you get paid over and over again as long as you continue to get referrals as long as the site is forever green and repeatable. This means that once you complete the offer requirements and are green, you can send referrals over and over and cash out for each greened referral.
      2. I believe there is a cap on everything. I'm not sure what exactly the cap would be on Freebie Trading because I've never seen anyone reach it (or even close to it). It all boils down to how much the advertisers are willing to pay. They have marketing budgets and there are many factors that go into determining what portion of that budget will go into paying for individuals to try out their service/product.
      3. You can never go green on the same site twice. That's against the Terms of Service. However, there is no real need to go green on the same site multiple times. The real money is when you move on to method 2, where you are just getting referrals. Also, most networks have multiple sites, and Zbestfreebies is one that has multiple sites. So, for example, if you go green on Paypal ZBestFreebies, you can still go green at football ZBestFreebies. In the same way, if you go green at 40 Macrobucks, you can go green at 60 Macrobucks with no problem. Those are all different sites.
      4. As long as they are valid leads, yes you should get paid for them. That would be a huge number of referrals in one day, but as long as you can manage to get that many referrals to go green you can get paid. The one major problem there would be is that you would have to take the time to train all those referrals or have a system in place to train them. That aspect is not as easy as it might seem. And yes, you can sell those referrals to people like me, but you would only get paid if their green turns out to be legitimate. Also, if you are doing that, you need to make sure that you aren't doing it at a trading forum where it isn't allowed.

      Hope that has answered your questions. If you have anymore, do not hesitate to ask.

      Blessings to you too!

  • john

    Hello everyone,, I am new at trading thing I STARTED YESTERDAY WITH GOING AND BUYING SOMETHING ON PROJECT PAY DAY AND IT LEANT ME TO NIS i TOOK TODAY TO PONDER THE IDEA OF BANGINGOUT HTESE GREENS FOR A PROFIT A 75 DOLLARS IF IM LUCK AND SOME OTHER THINGS THEN i had a idea!! I wante to know from you well groomed traders the abcs of the business i got the concept but i cant see the guys behind the doors that hold the money where does it begin the way i see it is these companies pay a guy who? and inturn pays lets say the guy who pays zollie and then there is the trader and then there is me plain joe working the greens is that how it works? But most important will there evercome a time when the money runs out ? and who decides this? I AM LOOKING TO GO GUN HO AT THIS BUT i had a few questions 1
    1 Can you get paid over and over again for referals

    2 If so is there a cap on this?

    3 Can I go green on the same sight twice?

    4. Can I have 4000 referals done in one day and if so will i get paid for them... and o another thing lets say I HAVE PEOPLE WHO WILL SAY SIT DOWN AND GO GREEN ON 6 SITES IN 4 HOURS INSTEAD OF USING THEM FOR MY OWN REFERAL CAN i JUST SELL THIS OUT RIGHT TO PEOPLE LIKE YOU?

    i would like to say hi again and would gladly appreciate any feed back on these questions with also some do and dont info if you got the time!! I t may be the thing that got u a reliable colleeg but if not a friend for the look over thanks and god bless

    Military vet saying thanks and god bless

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie

      Hi John, it seems like you are doing your due diligence and I applaud that. To answer your questions specifically:
      1. Yes you get paid over and over again as long as you continue to get referrals as long as the site is forever green and repeatable. This means that once you complete the offer requirements and are green, you can send referrals over and over and cash out for each greened referral.
      2. I believe there is a cap on everything. I'm not sure what exactly the cap would be on Freebie Trading because I've never seen anyone reach it (or even close to it). It all boils down to how much the advertisers are willing to pay. They have marketing budgets and there are many factors that go into determining what portion of that budget will go into paying for individuals to try out their service/product.
      3. You can never go green on the same site twice. That's against the Terms of Service. However, there is no real need to go green on the same site multiple times. The real money is when you move on to method 2, where you are just getting referrals. Also, most networks have multiple sites, and Zbestfreebies is one that has multiple sites. So, for example, if you go green on Paypal ZBestFreebies, you can still go green at football ZBestFreebies. In the same way, if you go green at 40 Macrobucks, you can go green at 60 Macrobucks with no problem. Those are all different sites.
      4. As long as they are valid leads, yes you should get paid for them. That would be a huge number of referrals in one day, but as long as you can manage to get that many referrals to go green you can get paid. The one major problem there would be is that you would have to take the time to train all those referrals or have a system in place to train them. That aspect is not as easy as it might seem. And yes, you can sell those referrals to people like me, but you would only get paid if their green turns out to be legitimate. Also, if you are doing that, you need to make sure that you aren't doing it at a trading forum where it isn't allowed.

      Hope that has answered your questions. If you have anymore, do not hesitate to ask.

      Blessings to you too!

  • Francine

    NIS has changed their website layout. If you havn't seen it, check it out. It's much more professional looking than before.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      Yes, they did a great job with that Francine.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie, The Freebie Guy

      Yes, they did a great job with that Francine.

  • Francine

    NIS has changed their website layout. If you havn't seen it, check it out. It's much more professional looking than before.

  • Francine

    NIS has changed their website layout. If you havn't seen it, check it out. It's much more professional looking than before.

    • http://www.becomeablogger.com/ Leslie

      Yes, they did a great job with that Francine.

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